[ale] OT: Anybody sick today?

[Stephen Touset]

On Tue, 2003-12-30 at 13:28, ChangingLINKS.com wrote:
> On Tuesday 30 December 2003 11:08, Stephen Touset wrote:
> > Unfortunately, most of the weight lost in the initial few weeks of the
> > Atkins diet is water; 
> Obviously you have not been on the diet. Otherwise you would *see*  that your 
> body becomes more trim.

My father was on it. Yes, he became more trim. Water has volume, too,
you know.

>  Also, people that diet tend to be more concerned 
> about their excercise and vice versa. When I am on the diet I drink a LOT 
> more water (often 2 Liters straight before riding,  close to 2 liters riding 
> 15 miles on the bike, 2 liters of sugar free koolaid for the rest of the 
> day).

That's actually a side effect of the Atkins diet. Since fat burning
takes more water, you need more of it. It's not that you're more health
conscious, it's that you're dehydrating quicker.

>  Also, I skip beer, caffine/chocolate. You are implying that the diet 
> ITSELF works as a diurectic(spelling). 
> 
> Support that with research.

Heh, there's plenty of it. It's a pretty well documented trait of
burning fat vs. carbs. Carbs require less water than fat, and fat
requires more than carbs.

> 
> > Also, I've never been a fan of treating symptoms. Most often, being
> > overweight is a symptom of larger health concerns--bad eating habits, lack
> > of exercise, etc.
> 
> People that diet tend to . . .. excercise more.

Not bloody likely. Most people diet in lieu of exercise.

>  Though I don't have the 
> article that says that, from my own experience and watching others, I can see 
> that the diet is a great way to start new habits. Go on the diet for a week, 
> and you will find it only neccessary to each once a day. Other times of the 
> day you may not feel hungry at all. This gives a person time to "get over" 
> bad eating habits, start from scratch and become more health conscious.

That above tells me that the diet is giving you irregular eating habits,
which wreaks havoc on your metabolism. It's far healthier to eat more
than your fill three times a day consistently than to eat your fill two
times a day, then three the next, then not eat the next, then two the
next day...

> > What you need to be treating is your health, not the
> > weight. 
> 
> No. I disagree. I feel that you need to treat BOTH. 

If you solve the first, the second goes away. Weight is not something
that will kill you--an unhealthy lifestyle will.

> Why? Atkins drops weight so fast, a person can see results. They are rewarded 
> for their effort more quickly, and therefore the is less time to "give up." 
> In my case I can drop the weight faster than I pick it up. I think most "hard 
> core (*zero* carb for a week - or more) Atkins dieters would say the same.

Unfortunately, it's not the weight that is the problem. Great, so you
lost 50lbs in four minutes--but are you actually any *healthier*? And by
imposing such stringent requirements, you're setting yourself up for
disaster from the get-go. Eat a cookie? You fucked up the diet.

> 
> > While Atkins may do a great job of dropping those scale numbers, it
> > also does a nice job of completely messing up the chemistry your body was
> > designed to handle, which can't be healthy.
> 
> Support that with some reasearch please. You claim it messes up the chemistry, 
> it sucks the water right out of your body through the skin like a vampire. :) 
> You fail to mention anything about the effects of obesity.

Obesity is the result of an unhealthy lifestyle. If you liposuction the
fat out directly, you're still not any healthier. Even worse, you still
don't have healthy lifestyle habits.

And please, everyone knows Atkins mucks with your metabolism--that's one
of the key parts. You switch over your metabolism from burning carbs to
burning fat. It's the goddamned cornerstone of the entire diet. On the
other hand, our bodies weren't *designed* for that type of diet--you
won't see anything similar in the diets of anyone in the history of
civilization that match up with that kind of diet. Grains, starches, and
other carbohydrate-laden foods have been the mainstay of the healthiest
civilizations' diets for centuries. Hell, look at Japan.

>  You fail to mention 
> that the Atkins diet forces the dieter away from McDonald's, extra desert, 
> and poor food combinations. You fail to mention how the Atkins diet forces us 
> to WATCH what we eat.

Any diet makes you "watch" what you eat. That's the *point* of a diet.
If the fact that Atkins prevents you from eating McDonalds is such an
important facet of the diet, according to you, any other diet on the
goddamned planet would suffice.

> > And in the end, it's not the
> > numbers on the scale that determine how long your heart keeps ticking, but
> > the other ones which get ignored when people equate being thin and light
> > with being healthy.
> 
> Hell the articles I posted before disagree. In one article I think it mentions 
> "obesity trumps a lot of other health issues." 
> Your attitude seems to be that someone is going to get on the Atkins diet 
> eating only steak forever, not work out, not take vitamins, and actually 
> become anorexic. It seems like you don't have experience with the diet, and 
> don't know anyone who has either. 

I've seen plenty. People go on diets so they don't have to
exercise--those who do exercise are by far the minority. Hell, exercise
machine manufacturers don't design their products to work for more than
six months (I believe--heard this from a friend in the industry, I may
have the exact figure wrong) because people buy them and stop using
them.

> The Atkins diet is visually, emotionally and physically rewarding.
> One does not have to do it "forever," and is still a great tool for reaching 
> health goals. 

It's a great tool for weight loss. Unfortunately, weight is only a thin
slice of the overall health pie.

> Read Jeff Hubs WORDS below and you will see he lost weight, he changed his 
> eating habits, he is successful. THAT is what Atkins is about. 

If losing weight and changing your eating habits are your goals, that's
great. I'm saying they shouldn't be. Your goal should be to live a
healthy lifestyle--eating better needs to be a part of that, not the
entirety.

-- 
Stephen Touset <stephen at touset.org>
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