[Fwd: Re: [Fwd: [ale] Red Hat and the GPL]]

Bob Toxen bob at verysecurelinux.com
Mon Dec 15 21:44:08 EST 2003


Thanks for that useful information.

Bob

On Fri, Dec 12, 2003 at 09:49:01PM -0500, Jonathan Glass wrote:
> From the horse's mouth.
> 
> Jonathan Glass
> 
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> Date: 	Fri, 12 Dec 2003 13:37:41 -0500
> From: 	Brian Cole <bcole at redhat.com>
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> To: 	Jonathan Glass <jonathan.glass at ibb.gatech.edu>
> Subject: 	Re: [Fwd: [ale] Red Hat and the GPL]
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> 
> 
> Jonathan,
> 
> I am sorry I did not respond to you sooner.  
> 
> In December 2002 we submitted a full copy of the RHEL Subscription 
> Agreement to legal counsel for the Free Software Foundation for review 
> along with our background explanation on how it is intended to work and 
> why we don't believe it violates the GPL. Outside counsel for the FSF 
> completed his review and concurred that there is nothing in this model 
> that inherently violates the GPL.
> 
> If you need further clarification let me know.  Obviously our legal 
> counsel has reviewed all of our agreements before we used them.  We are 
> not inviolation of the GPL.
> 
> Thanks,
> Brian
> 
> Jonathan Glass wrote:
> 
> >-----Forwarded Message-----
> >From: Bob Toxen <bob at verysecurelinux.com>
> >To: ale at ale.org
> >Subject: [ale] Red Hat and the GPL
> >Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2003 14:51:39 -0500
> >
> >The individual copyright holders of the software that comprise the
> >Linux OS and related user and library code should tell Red Hat: "NO!
> >You cannot do that [putting restrictions on GPL'ed code] and must stop 
> >now!"
> >
> >"NO!  You cannot distribute OUR copyrighted code on the condition that
> >the Red Hat customer agree to additional restrictions such as:
> >
> > 1. Not distributing patches among all of your machines and clients.
> >
> > 2. Charging fees in excess of reasonable copying fees for distributing
> >    GPL-licensed Open Source
> >
> > 3. A purchaser of a Red Hat CD-ROM (or downloaded CD-ROM image) cannot
> >    distribute it "because of red hat trademark logos".
> >
> >Red Hat currently is doing these things and I think that this constitutes
> >copyright infringement in that they are using copyrighted code in ways
> >clearly forbidden by the GPL.
> >
> >Have a look at the GPL at
> >
> >    http://www.fsf.org/licenses/gpl.html
> >
> >as I did in preparing this email.  It appears to me that Red Hat is
> >in violation of the GPL for demanding these restrictions of its customers.
> >
> >The portions of the GPL that seem most relevant to me are:
> >
> >    "To protect your rights, we need to make restrictions that forbid
> >    anyone to deny you these rights or to ask you to surrender the
> >    rights. These restrictions translate to certain responsibilities for
> >    you if you distribute copies of the software, or if you modify it.
> >    ...
> >    "You may charge a fee for the physical act of transferring a copy,
> >    and you may at your option offer warranty protection in exchange
> >    for a fee.
> >Warranty protection means, I believe, that Red Hat may charge money for
> >fixing bugs.  However, it cannot put "per seat" or "per system" 
> >restrictions
> >or fees on patches for GPL'ed code.  I.e., they must make patches (usually
> >engineered by an Open Source entity other than Red Hat) available for a
> >low cost or at no cost.
> >    ...
> >    "These requirements apply to the modified work as a whole. If
> >    identifiable sections of that work are not derived from the Program,
> >    and can be reasonably considered independent and separate works in
> >    themselves, then this License, and its terms, do not apply to those
> >    sections when you distribute them as separate works. But when you
> >    distribute the same sections as part of a whole which is a work
> >    based on the Program, the distribution of the whole must be on the
> >    terms of this License, whose permissions for other licensees extend
> >    to the entire whole, and thus to each and every part regardless of
> >    who wrote it.
> >
> >That requirement seems to make illegal Red Hat's published policy of
> >forbidding others from redistributing "Red Hat Linux" in either original
> >or modified form claiming that to do so would be illegally using Red Hat's
> >trademarked images scattered throughout the boot process, documentation,
> >and elsewhere.  It appears to me the "These requirements apply to the
> >modified work as a whole."  requirement of the GPL expressly forbid
> >this practice.
> >
> >    "6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on
> >    the Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from
> >    the original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program
> >    subject to these terms and conditions. You may not impose any
> >    further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights
> >    granted herein.
> >
> >
> >
> >I suggest that we contact some of the copyright holders of GPL'ed code
> >and see if there's agreement to contact Red Hat and tell them to stop
> >their current practice as it is bad for Linux and the community.
> >
> >(While I consider myself more knowledgeable in contract and copyright
> >law than the average person, I am not an attorney.  Any statements by
> >myself here are my opinion.)
> >
> >Best regards,
> >
> >Bob Toxen, CTO
> >Fly-By-Day Consulting, Inc.
> >
> >Author,
> >"Real World Linux Security: Intrusion Detection, Prevention, and Recovery"
> >2nd Ed., Prentice Hall, (C) 2003, 848 pages, ISBN: 0130464562
> >Also available in Japanese, Chinese, and Czech.
> >
> >http://www.verysecurelinux.com       [Network & Linux/Unix Security 
> >Consulting]
> >http://www.realworldlinuxsecurity.com [My 5* book: "Real World Linux 
> >Security"]
> >http://www.verysecurelinux.com/sunset.html                    [Sunset 
> >Computer]
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ale mailing list
> >Ale at ale.org
> >http://www.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale
> > 
> >
> 
> -- 
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