[ale] New Mailing List initiatives for ALE

[Jerald Sheets]

** The Problem **

After much discussion, informal polling, email back and forth and  
various generic conversation, Those of us charged with the  
maintenance, care, and feeding of the ALE mailing list(s) will be  
bringing about some changes in the near future.  Please allow me to  
discourse below:

There has been an increasing amount of "reaction" as our list becomes  
more diverse and varied.  Unfortunately, due to the propensity of  
some of us to blather on (raises hand..."Guilty!) regarding many  
topics unrelated to linux, UNIX, technology, or other geekery, we  
have lost some great personalities, talent, minds, and contributors  
to this community.

I started taking an informal poll around April (around when we  
started doing ALE-NW at my offices) and got a startling congruity of  
response.  My question:  How about joining the ALE list, we could  
really use experience such as yours to contribute to the topics and  
such.  Overwhelmingly, the answer has been that these persons  
(sysadmins and speakers from all walks and from many companies that  
make up the "top 10" of Atlanta) could not afford the sheer volume of  
emails unrelated to their work.

I have suggested the gmail/Yahoo! Mail solution to no avail.  These  
people (who arguably would be the busiest in our industry) replied  
(nearly without fail) that there was no way they had the time to  
manage yet another mail client with yet another list, and then to do  
the single thing they did not want to do in the first place (pore  
through hundreds of off-topic posts) due to the lack of time they  
have.  I can relate. (Hurricane Katrina anyone?)

Add to that the few we have lost recently that I have been able to  
speak with (some are not answering email) and the off-topic nature of  
our list is again the culprit.  An unexpected (although not  
surprising) reason given is that on occasion we tend to get a bit off- 
color in our language from time to time and a varying array of things  
can happen.  Business mail systems can bounce the messages and then  
Mailman cruelly unsubscribes you due to bounces.  Or, worse yet, your  
email can get flagged and membership can find themselves being  
questioned by the resident mail nazi/security/HR/auditing poobah  
which we all know how pleasant that can be.

As such, something really needs to be done.  Many suggestions have  
been floated, some of which had merit, some of which never had  
merit.  ;)

** Evaluation **

People have suggested fully moderating the list.  I would offer this  
is the least desirable.  We are all adults here (with the occasional  
minor thrown in for good measure).  We understand that when topics  
float away from tech and into politics (whether related or unrelated  
to tech) that personal sacred cows get the holy-hand grenade of death  
by standers-by, feelings are hurt, epithets are thrown, and the list  
quiets for a small bit of time until things crank back up to the same- 
old stuff.  Case in point, our esteemed Chris Farris has recently  
left us through a thread that began simply as "Ping!".  Look at  
today's threads...we have another.  Will someone else of quality and  
merit as Chris is be convinced that this is the last straw and leave  
us for good?  Lord, I hope not.

Some have suggested that an Internet forum is the way to go.   
Proponents say you have an archive, and there's interactivity, etc.   
However, our ale Mailman archive on-line tends to deliver more and  
more answers as I google for results over time.  It is proving an  
invaluable resource (to me, anyhow...I can't be alone, can I?) on  
HOWTO information dating back quite a few years.  It would be a loss  
to the community to discontinue that archive in favor of forums.   
Further, our Pine, mail, and elm friends (insert text email client of  
your choice here) would not be able to fetchmail their ale mail to  
read from "spacebar heaven" on the headless client of their choice.

curses.

One proposal that gained legs in the discussions is that of adding to  
& modifying the rules of our current lists, and to structure them to  
encourage us to keep our enthusiast/community focus, but to allow  
persons to participate in a "low-noise" list, thus retaining quality  
individuals that we are losing/have lost, and to encourage yet  
unsubscribed individuals to come and be a part.

** The Solution **


Thus, [ale] 2.0  (or whatever our revision is these days...I'm new to  
the party) is now in the process of gestation.

Currently, the ale suite of mailing lists is as follows:

[ale]
an mailing list, for general Linux questions, discussions and  
information. Feel free to post questions here.

[unemployed]
A discussion list for un-employed Techies in the Atlanta Area


** The Layout **

We will be undertaking to do some splitting of the lists to better  
serve the varied interests of membership and simultaneously keep an  
"enthusiast" air to our dealings.  The model we are adopting was  
first seen at the DC Area Systems Administrator's Guild site:  dc- 
sage.org.

**********

[ale-announce]   (ale-announce at ale.org)
This list is moderated and posting is restricted. The sole purpose of  
this mailing list is to make announcements to the entire membership  
of [ale] members about upcoming [ale] events. Any other postings  
(including announcements from other organizations) belong in the  
[ale] list.

**********

[ale]  (ale at ale.org)
This is the original mailing list that defined [ale] membership.  
Discussions should be (at least tangentially) relevant to systems  
administration, or sysadmin issues in Atlanta. This list will be  
moderated for members of [ale] to post to and subscribe to. All  
posting attempts will be moderated for relevance to existing threads  
and content.

For instance:  A topic regarding any technical topic is fair game,  
from wireless routers to Linux admin to UNIX admin to "name your tech  
topic here".  Not unlike the current list.  Even political discourse  
regarding technical issues (DMCA, p2p, etc.) is also acceptable  
material.  These are issues which we all encounter and experience in  
day-to-day administration and technical pursuits.

However, a post regarding war in Iraq, how global warming is Bush's  
fault, and he caused hurricane Katrina to oust poor minorities from  
their homes in New orleans so they can no longer vote as a block  
against Republican interests so Republicans can continue to prepare a  
"new world order" mindset to make it easier for the aliens to take  
over when they invade...  Unacceptable for this list, and will be  
draconianly and unceremoniously moderated.  (i.e. never see the light  
of day)

**********

[ale-chat]  (ale-chat at ale.org)
This is a new mailing list for random thoughts and babbles to/for/ 
about [ale] members. This list is unmoderated for members of [ale] to  
post to and subscribe to. This list is where you should post if you  
believe that the topic does not really pertain to everyone and anyone  
on the list. In fact, this list is probably best used as an [ale]  
BBS, except that any member may subscribe to this list and receive  
the messages in real time instead of reading them from the web ... if  
that is what you want.  Translation:  anything goes!  Just as today's  
[ale] list exists, [ale-chat] will exist.  Membership will be  
encouraged to engage in more technical discourse on [ale], but [ale- 
chat] will remain free and unfettered for all the pinging, ponging,  
and politics it can handle.

**********

The current plan of attack is as follows:

1.  Get an export of every user, and place them into the moderated/ 
admin-only no-reply [ale-announce] list. Recall that this list is  
required to be on any [ale] mailing list.  The only mail you will  
receive from this list will be the announcement that it is live, and  
you are on it, and meeting/organizational announcements of the [ale]  
organization.  You may, if you wish, only belong to this list.   
Expect >10 emails per month.

2. Migrate all membership from [ale] to [ale-chat].  This will  
facilitate persons who don't wish to change or move to stay exactly  
as they are with no changes other than (a) the email you use to post  
to the list and (b) changing your own mail filters to reflect the new  
list address.  Expect email traffic roughly analogous to the current  
list, but perhaps diminishing as [ale] gains acceptance/popularity.

3.  Create and publish the new [ale] list and open it up for  
registrations via Mailman.  This will be the moderated, on-topic only  
mailing list.  If you are buried under work, you can unsub from ale- 
chat, just keeping ale and ale-announce.  Or, if you prefer, you can  
unsub from [ale] altogether and only be on [ale-announce and [ale-chat].

The point is, it's your choice.  You can get involved, or just  
leisurely chat with geeks of like-interest, all while still receiving  
important [ale] announcements.

Well, that's it.  I'm sure there'll be a TON of opinions, both good  
and bad, but at this time it just seems that these steps are the best  
for the group.  It may succeed wildly, and it may fail miserably.   
Point is, we will have tried, and will actually know.

Feel free to comment.  I look forward to hearing everyone's thoughts.

Jerald Sheets
Host, ALE-NW
All around nice-guy.  No, really.
Sysadmin, The Weather Channel



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