[ale] VOTE: Take the root war off-list

[Barry Hawkins]

On Mon, May 23, 2005 at 02:50:46PM -0400, Jim Popovitch spake thus:
> On Mon, 2005-05-23 at 14:38 -0400, Barry Hawkins wrote:
> > Agreed.  Folks, if you had a problem with it, you should have said 
> > something at the time.  It's time to let go.
> 
> Would their silence indicate a problem or a non-problem, and which is
> truly better?  :-)
Jim,

That sounds like another philosophical question with no short answer. 
I haven't the spare time for that sort of sparring. :-)  I think the 
responses, albeit late, are an indicator that quite a few people were 
really annoyed by that saga, but in the interest of moving on, I 
thought I'd encourage folks to not comment on it any further.

(Editorial Note: I hesitated to post the rest of this, since it may 
result in my being flamed to hell and back.  But, it is my open and 
honest perception, so maybe being willing to take one for the team 
could result in some productive dialog about community within ALE.)

When I first joined this list a scant several months ago, I commented 
to a friend who is also on the list that it seemed like a really good 
one with low signal-to-noise.  He told me I should just stick around 
long enough.  Since the election took place a couple of months later, 
I soon saw what he meant.  These crabby flamewars do nothing to 
promote community within ALE, and if anything they are a huge turnoff 
to newcomers.

I have been to about 5 of the last 8 meetings for Central.  I can 
vouch for the fact that it could certainly use some new blood, and 
I would imagine from the hiatus of the NW group that it could use 
some, too.  When folks come on the list and see a handful of folks 
willing to beat issues to death and flame one another, the best you 
can hope for is a 'wait and see' attitude from them regarding 
participation and potential future leadership.  So, the same handful of 
folks like Geoffrey, Aaron, Harold, and Michael (whom we miss greatly) 
shoulder the burden.  (I am sure I am leaving out some, but please 
know that it is because of my ignorance.)

There just aren't a ton of folks who enjoy being part of a group 
where a handful of the sages or gurus like to hammer one another 
with flamefests.  It really squelches openness and usually makes 
the newcomer think "Good God, I had better not ask _my_ naive 
question, I'll probably get clobbered!"  It could be that 
the majority may say, "fine, who needs 'em if they're gonna be 
that way!"  Well, OK, but realize that the cost of that is a 
stagnant group without significant numbers to justify a steady 
stream of good meetings and events with quality speakers.  

I think if those who have jeered at this thread's responses 
would bear in mind what the goal of ALE is, they would see that 
it's not something to mock, but rather a symptom that may help 
us find ways to improve the community within ALE.

Sincerely,
-- 
Barry Hawkins
All Things Computed
site: www.alltc.com
weblog: www.yepthatsme.com

Registered Linux User #368650