[ale] CS Degree necessary?

[Jay Fox]

I agree with Lance.  My "non-technical" degree landed me my first IT job.
>From there it was the experience that I gained at a previous job that got me
a new position elsewhere.  Would my salary have been higher if I had a CS or
MIS degree?  Probably initially but at this point I don't think so.
In my opinion, a IT career is not a job, its a lifestyle of reading about
and learning about the newest technologies.
Jay
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lance Smith" <lancesmith at charter.net>
To: ale at ale.org
To: "Ale" <ale at ale.org>
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2002 7:38 AM
Subject: Re: [ale] CS Degree necessary?


: Heres a splash of cold water.
:
: I have been doing quite well in the field of IT.  I have a degree "Mass
: Communications/ Speech" Translated for you none eclectic types "Acting".
Thats
: right Acting.  I am a college trained stage actor.  But I make more money
: "screwing" with computers and mainframes.  I am not the best, but I know
it and
: I do not try to "act" like I am the best.
:
: The point, a degree is a piece of paper that says you are "trainable", it
has
: nothing to do with wether you are "capable"
:
: Lance
:
:
: Christopher Bergeron wrote:
:
: > I actually was going to lease that car, but because my credit wasn't
good
: > enough, I couldn't.  The writer is who contacted me: Scott Fullam is his
: > name (he's an MIT student).  He's actually going to write the chapter.
: >
: > I also own: http://www.carbonfiberpc.com/ which sells designer computer
: > peripherals and such... The point is that my degree didn't teach me how
to
: > be creative and intelligent.  My intellect did.  The degree was a means
to
: > an end.  My ultimate goal is to be a serial entrepreneur and as such a
: > degree is worthless.  However, I do have to have good income to
"experiment"
: > with my crazy ventures.  Hopefully one of them will be successful, but
could
: > I have gotten there without the degree?  That's certainly up for debate.
If
: > I don't order a pizza tonight could it affect the rest of my life?  Who
: > knows...!  I saw a post about this earlier that summed it up perfectly:
: > Know yourself and what you want.  Know who _you_ are and what _you_ want
and
: > you'll get where _you_ want to be.  Consciously or subconsciously...
(unless
: > of course you use M$ Windows).
: >
: > :)
: >
: > -CB
: >
: > > -----Original Message-----
: > > From: kschmidt at mindspring.com [mailto:kschmidt at mindspring.com]
: > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 11:27 PM
: > > To: Christopher Bergeron
: > > Subject: Re: RE: RE: [ale] CS Degree necessary?
: > >
: > >
: > >
: > > Awesome! How'd they work out the royalty thing, given that you're
: > > only contributing a chapter?
: > >
: > > At any rate, I like the dashpc thing. If I weren't leasing my
: > > car, I'd love to do something like that.
: > >
: > > -Kevin
: > >
: > > Christopher Bergeron <christopher at bergeron.com> wrote:
: > > > Kevin- speaking of O'Reilly, my DashPC project
: > > (http://www.dashpc.com) is
: > > going to have a chapter in a new book by O'Reilly about "Cool
: > > Linux hacks".
: > > It's going to be published sometime this year.  I don't know the
: > > book title
: > > just yet.  The project is also going to be the cover story in the
March
: > > issue of "Free Source" magazine...
: > >
: > > (back to the subject)
: > >
: > > I agree with you about the degree thing.  I know of a few CS grads
that
: > > "just don't get it" and I know of some genius "dropouts".
: > > :)
: > >
: > >
: > >
: > > > -----Original Message-----
: > > > From: kschmidt at mindspring.com [mailto:kschmidt at mindspring.com]
: > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 10:50 PM
: > > > To: Christopher Bergeron
: > > > Cc: Michael Golden; Ale
: > > > Subject: Re: RE: [ale] CS Degree necessary?
: > > >
: > > >
: > > >
: > > > I must be one of those exceptions, I guess. I've been using
: > > > computers since age nine, programming since age 10, and working
: > > > full time in the field for almost 10 years (I'm now 28). Not
: > > > having a degree hasn't hurt me at all. Heck, I've written an
: > > > O'Reilly book and have started on a second one.
: > > >
: > > > Just because you stick it for four years doesn't guarantee that
: > > > you're worth a damn. I've met some real clueless people who had
: > > > CS degrees. And some of the best coders I've known where either
: > > > college drop outs or guys with non-CS degrees.
: > > >
: > > > Here's my take: If you have zero experience, then having a degree
: > > > will get you in the door. But it has been my "experience" that if
: > > > you know your sh*t, then you will never have a problem, degree or
: > > > no degree.
: > > >
: > > > -Kevin
: > > >
: > > >
: > > > Christopher Bergeron  wrote:
: > > > > Michael, I went to Florida State for CS, but ended up with a
: > > > degree in MIS
: > > > because I'm not very good at higher mathematics (go figure).  I've
got a
: > > > great job and this might be blasphemous to some, but I make
: > > more than the
: > > > guy with the CS degree in my office.  I highly respect what the
: > > CS majors
: > > > had to go through to get thier degrees - I just couldn't hack it.
: > > > ....buuuuut, since I'm more experienced (I've been hacking since
High
: > > > School) I equate that to my overall higher salary.  I tend to think
that
: > > > salaries in general are a logarithmic curve.  When you're not
: > > > educated it's
: > > > harder to get to the apex, and when you're too educated you're
actually
: > > > overvalued and it's harder to find work (ever talk to someone
: > > > with multiple
: > > > degree's and a phD or master's in CS that _wasn't_ an instructor or
: > > > professor? - neither have I).  The point of all this is that (IMHO)
it's
: > > > important to _have_ a degree; but ultimately your experience
: > > will pave the
: > > > way of your career.  The degree will get you into interviews that
: > > > you could
: > > > not normally get and as a result I think you'll do much better than
with
: > > > just experience alone and no degree.  Although, to be practical I
: > > > don't know
: > > > how far a degree in "Paperclip Art" would get you.  You have to be
: > > > realistic.
: > > >
: > > > That's just my take on things,
: > > > -CB
: > > >
: > > > P.S.
: > > > I'm 25 years old and according to salary.com I make in the
middle-upper
: > > > percentile of salaries for my job description (unix admin) adjusted
for
: > > > geometery of course!  [or is that geography!?]
: > > > :)
: > > >
: > > >
: > > >
: > > > > -----Original Message-----
: > > > > From: Michael Golden [mailto:naugrimk at yahoo.com]
: > > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 7:56 PM
: > > > > To: ale at ale.org
: > > > > Subject: [ale] CS Degree necessary?
: > > > >
: > > > >
: > > > > Hi,
: > > > >   I know a similar thread has gone on in this list a while
: > > > > back but for
: > > > > one I'm too lazy right now to go back and try to find it and
: > > two I don't
: > > > > recall well enough if it addressed this exact topic.
: > > > >   Right now I am set up to major in Computer Science but I've
: > > > > only been
: > > > > taking general education core classes so far. I was talking to
people
: > > > > about some of the classes for the major and I took a look through
them
: > > > > myself and I'm not sure how interested I am in taking half of
: > > them. I'd
: > > > > like to have a career in computers but I don't know how much
: > > I'll enjoy
: > > > > this major.
: > > > >   Is a CS degree really necessary in the real world for computer
jobs?
: > > > > What are the advantages/disadvantages to having it? Anything else
to
: > > > > add?
: > > > >
: > > > > Michael
: > > > >
: > > > >
: > > > >
: > > > > ---
: > > > > This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion
list.
: > > > > See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info.
: > > > > Problems should be
: > > > > sent to listmaster at ale dot org.
: > > > >
: > > > >
: > > >
: > > >
: > > > ---
: > > > This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion list.
: > > > See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info.
: > > > Problems should be
: > > > sent to listmaster at ale dot org.
: > > >
: > > >
: > > >
: > > > ---
: > > > This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion list.
: > > > See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info.
: > > > Problems should be
: > > > sent to listmaster at ale dot org.
: > > >
: > > >
: > >
: > >
: > > ---
: > > This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion list.
: > > See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info.
: > > Problems should be
: > > sent to listmaster at ale dot org.
: > >
: > >
: > >
: >
: > ---
: > This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion list.
: > See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info. Problems
should be
: > sent to listmaster at ale dot org.
:
:
: ---
: This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion list.
: See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info. Problems should
be
: sent to listmaster at ale dot org.


_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com


---
This message has been sent through the ALE general discussion list.
See http://www.ale.org/mailing-lists.shtml for more info. Problems should be 
sent to listmaster at ale dot org.