[ale] systemd or not

Fri Sep 5 10:46:33 EDT 2014

On Fri, 2014-09-05 at 09:50 -0400, Michael Trausch wrote:
> Will explain later---but you WANT systemd. Really. It's much, MUCH
> more efficient. And allows you to have a 4 package system,
> essentially. And makes a lot of sense to work with once you get to
> know it well. 

Really.  Look at the dependencies in systemd.  Especially this one:

[mhw at canyon ~]$ rpm -qlR systemd | grep qr
libqrencode.so.3()(64bit)
[mhw at canyon ~]$

Explain to me why in all of hades an init system needs QR codes?

I discovered this in the process of working on trim downs in NST
(Network Security Toolkit) and found that a considerable amount of the
bloated fat getting in my way of shoehorning that back onto bootable
CD's was things like that.

Joking with Serge Hallyn of the LXC project (which sadly considers me
the systemd expert) we were both wondering when Systemd would add a
"Minesweeper" component and make it mandatory.

Regards,
Mike

> Sent from my iPad
> 
> > On Sep 5, 2014, at 8:30 AM, James Sumners <james.sumners at gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > I stopped using Arch Linux because they forced systemd on us (me). I'm
> > thoroughly disappointed that the next release of Debian is also forcing a
> > move to it. But, really, they don't have an option:
> > 
> > "In November 2012, the GNOME Project concluded that basic GNOME
> > functionality should not rely on systemd.[16]
> > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemd#cite_note-16> However, in
> > contradiction of this statement, GNOME 3.8 introduced a *de facto* dependency
> > on systemd by introducing session management behaviors which depend on how
> > systemd operates. While the developers of Gentoo Linux
> > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentoo_Linux>attempted to adapt these changes
> > in OpenRC <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenRC>, the implementation
> > contained too many bugs, causing the distribution to mark systemd as a
> > dependency of GNOME." --
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemd#GNOME_integration
> > 
> > So, a distribution either _doesn't_ include GNOME (no loss in my opinion,
> > but people do like it), or it includes GNOME at the cost of also having to
> > include systemd.
> > 
> > What it comes down to is the developers of systemd. This package is brought
> > to you by the same person who gave us the wonderfully useless and awful
> > Pulse Audio system. And his cohorts routinely draw the ire of others:
> > 
> > https://lkml.org/lkml/2014/4/2/420
> > https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=76935 (whole thing is worth
> > reading for much enlightenment)
> > 
> > So, we have a project run by people who like to force their software onto
> > others by getting it included as a non-optional dependency who then go on
> > to not give a damn about what their bugs break or whom they affect. Now,
> > they want to take over the whole damn system --
> > http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
> > 
> > I agree with the "systemd is a trojan" statement. I very much agree with it.
> > 
> > 
> >> On Fri, Sep 5, 2014 at 7:55 AM, Boris Borisov <bugyatl at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> 
> >> http://www.technewsworld.com/story/80980.html
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> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > James Sumners
> > http://james.roomfullofmirrors.com/
> > 
> > "All governments suffer a recurring problem: Power attracts pathological
> > personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the
> > corruptible. Such people have a tendency to become drunk on violence, a
> > condition to which they are quickly addicted."
> > 
> > Missionaria Protectiva, Text QIV (decto)
> > CH:D 59
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-- 
Michael H. Warfield (AI4NB) | (770) 978-7061 |  mhw at WittsEnd.com
   /\/\|=mhw=|\/\/          | (678) 463-0932 |  http://www.wittsend.com/mhw/
   NIC whois: MHW9          | An optimist believes we live in the best of all
 PGP Key: 0x674627FF        | possible worlds.  A pessimist is sure of it!

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