[ale] OT but IT related question regarding certifications

Mon Mar 29 09:19:36 EDT 2010

By and large employers are mainly interested in experience.   Someone walking in the door with 20 certifications and no work experience is less likely to get the job than someone with 5 years experience and no certifications.   In IT you can succeed even without a college degree so long as you're experienced enough.   In fact employers (or recruiters) often focus on specific experience.   I once got a job with ~5 years of Solaris experience only because it had been on the E10K when a woman I knew with much more Sun/Solaris experience didn't even get an interview because she hadn't worked on the E10K.   

This doesn't mean certifications have no value - they can make the difference between who gets the interview in the first place given equal levels of experience.  Also training with or without certification at the end is always a plus.   Up until 2 years ago I'd gotten no certifications but have tons of training classes.   My main reason for thinking certifications might have value in years to come has to do with the M$ mindset where everyone seems to be an MSCE and those folks are rolling into the Linux world in many organizations that didn't previously have UNIX.

Of course the job market itself dictates standards.   Back when I was a hiring manager I once got so many applications I started weeding out people based on experience first, college degree second, etc... just so I'd get down to a manageable stack of folks to interview.   However in the boom years of the 90s chances were you'd get an interview if you applied because the competition for employees was fairly fierce.   We hired one guy who obviously had very little experience where previously we wouldn't have even talked to him mainly because he did have training classes.   However, that wasn't the norm - usually if you didn't have at least 5 years of experience you didn't get past the recruiter to us.

-----Original Message-----
From: ale-bounces at ale.org [mailto:ale-bounces at ale.org] On Behalf Of scott mcbrien
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:33 PM
To: rfaulkner at 34thprs.org; Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts - Yes! We run Linux!
Subject: Re: [ale] OT but IT related question regarding certifications

I've been in the IT Certification arena for a long time, the most
important thing IMO is making sure that you have the right
expectations on what a certification is going to do for you.  The days
of having a certification on your resume and getting hired are gone.
A certification will help you get an interview, but ultimately selling
yourself and your skills in the interview is what is going to get you
a job.

I'm a proponent of the Red Hat certifications, but am jaded as I
worked on the RHCE/RHCA team for 6 years.  However, in the Linux
sysadmin community RHCT/RHCE are kind of the standards.

If anyone is interested in Red Hat training, I can give a 10% discount
on whatever RH charges, my company is an authorized
training/certification reseller.

-Scott

On Sun, Mar 28, 2010 at 5:08 PM, Richard Faulkner <rfaulkner at 34thprs.org> wrote:
> Well, it depends.  It depends on who you talk to as far as employers and
> where you get the education.
>
> I was a tech instructor at New Horizons of Washington DC from 2004-06
> and taught A+, Net+ and ICND and can give you these words of advice...
>
> 1.  Network+ is like a typing test.  Nothing much to it (you don't even
>    have to do subnetting as I saw.
> 2.  Larger companies will like certs (especially those stuck with doing
>    hiring who are non-technical).
> 3.  Beware of technical schools as often times they have total noobs
>    teaching the classes -- newly certified instructors w/little or no
>    real-world experience.
> 4.  Certs CAN make a difference in getting the job but are NOT the only
>    thing that employers want (especially in this economy)
>
> Case-in-point...in 2004 I applied for a position with XM Satellite Radio
> in Washington DC as a tech in the Broadcast Technical Support shop.
> They flattly passed me over.  At that time I was MCP/MCP+I/MCSE
> *whatever*.  I get the chance to teach and decide that's a good way to
> go to *really* learn the material and do exactly that.  I also take the
> A+ tests and Net+ as well as CCNA.
>
> In 2006 I applied again at XM and get swallowed-up fast and part of that
> due to my A+/Net+ certs.  The first time around they didn't need a MCSE,
> the second time around they wanted the full-meal deal.  I've been doing
> tech since 1995 and have been messing with computers since 1979 and
> working with computers since 1985.  I'm farthest from knowing
> *everything* and have much to learn but certs don't hurt at all.  BUT
> they don't replace good ole' fashioned EXPERIENCE!  Get that at all
> costs and be ready to do a lot of networking (especially in this
> market).
>
> I'm getting ready to do Linux certs as well and will likely focus on
> Redhat as well.  Agnostic certs are great but at some point you'll want
> to make a decision on what direction you want to go.  Once hired your
> employer will skew your education the way they want it to be and you go
> on from there.
>
> Hope that helps!  Not that I'm a know-it-all but that's been my
> experience.
>
> On Sun, 2010-03-28 at 14:49 -0400, Van Loggins wrote:
>> I'm currently unemployed and looking into getting some new
>> certifications to help me get a new job.
>>
>> I currently only have CompTIA A+ certification.
>>
>> I was thinking about getting CompTIA Linux+ or CompTIA Network+
>> certifications.
>>
>> Are these worth getting or would there be a better certification for me
>> to get.
>>
>> I don't have a lot of money to work with as my unemployment check only
>> goes so far so I want to make sure whatever I get is worth getting and
>> will help me get a new job soon.
>>
>
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