[ale] Let's Party! (To celebrate computer viruses!)

[JK]

Michael B. Trausch wrote:


Setting phaser on "snip"...


> This is a technical list.  We also share humor, anecdotes, and opinions.

...

> Many Windows users do not even realize that there's a viable other
> choice out there for them, and the empty bashing is easily perceived by
> users of the system as attacks against them.


Yes.  And I agree that the dismissive hackronyms don't help the cause
of attracting new users to the platform.  It's not totally clear that
that's what ALE is about, though.

MHO: Pejorative language of the sort we're discussing is certainly not
useful as a form of argument. It is essentially an in-group/out-group
mechanism, the effect of which is to make the in-group more cohesive,
and to exclude those who aren't able or willing to adopt the in-group
lingo.

Not only that, that sort of language is sometimes associated with a lack
of rational arguments and evidential reasons for the in-group's position.
(I'll omit the examples, since I'd probably be accused of political
ranting.) In other words, even *if* there are genuinely good reasons for
the users of pejorative language to hold the opinions they do, onlookers
may not realize this; and not realizing it, they may perceive the
pejorative language as a poor stand-in for reasoned argument.

That's not to say I object to the lingo.  I find it amusing, generally.
And I *like* being part of the in-group :-)

...


> If this list were _not_ advertised as a welcoming environment for
> newbies and veterans alike to get together and discuss our favorite
> operating system kernel


*Is* it so advertised?  The name of the group is Atlanta LINUX
ENTHUSIASTS, so some enthusiasm for Linux -- perhaps even some
irrational exuberance -- is to be expected.  It's not just your
milquetoast Atlanta Linux User's Group.

(Also, how could Linux be a newb's favorite kernel? Presumably
they don't yet have the experience to make an informed judgment.
Which, OK, yeah, doesn't always stop people from making UN-informed
ones.)

...


> Unless I'm woefully mistaken, it's supposed to be a welcoming
> environment to help everyone, newbies like (maybe) our parents and
> grandparents, and veterans who've been using UNIX since the 70s or
> earlier, alike.


Having been subscribed to ALE for... holy spit, something like
17 years now, I can categorically state that it is NOT always
a welcoming environment.  Some pretty harsh words have flown
around, and I'm dead certain some newbs have been driven off from
time to time.

On the other hand, I don't think "Be Nice" is part of the ALE
charter. (I don't know, I've never seen the charter. But if
"Be Nice" were in there, I think someone would've quoted chapter
and verse by now, and on many other historical occasions.)

Maybe it SHOULD be a more welcoming forum for newbs.  I don't
know.  I like ALE the way it is, because it has a very nice
property: if you ask a question, you're likely to get a number
of technically sound answers, and very little chaff with that
wheat.  As technologies and their fora become more popular, the
S/N ratio goes in the toilet.  (A tragic example: comp.lang.python.
Between about 1996 and 2003, the quality of technical content
in that group really took a nosedive.)

About religious wars in general (ranting now, feel [even more]
free to ignore the following):

The emacs/vi/nano wars are just silly.  You use enough editors,
eventually you realize a very obvious fact: it's just preference.
Seriously, vim and emacs are both technically solid editors that
can be made to do whatever you want them to (literally, since
they're both Turing-complete). And lots of other religious wars
have this same feature: they basically reduce to a series of
claims that "My preference is better than your preference."
These wars are avoided by wise humans.

In other cases, the zeal is driven by real underlying technical
issues, and I think that's definitely the case in the Windows-v-Linux
controversy.  However, there is also a very large element of
preference in one's OS choice, and it is difficult for many people
to separate those things.

I'll state for the record:  I prefer Windows XP as my everyday
desktop OS.  I have to use it for work, and that being the
case, it's just easier to use it for all my personal productivity.
OTOH I'm well aware of its flaws and limitations, and I'm making
an informed decision to live with them.  Also, I've stopped
encouraging random acquaintances to switch from Windows to
Linux for their desktop, for two very simple reasons: (1) I
don't have the time or interest to keep up with the rapidly
changing Linux UI scene, so it's almost impossible to support
people remotely; and (2) I have inevitably ended up being the
first line of technical support for people I've converted
in that way, and I really don't like that.

Or, Shorter JK:  "Winblows suxxorz, but whatever. Use it anyway
if you want."

-- JK