[ale] [rant] I dislike "we only support winblows/OS X"AT&T internet
Dan Lambert
danlambert at bellsouth.net
Mon Mar 3 16:31:02 EST 2008
Sorry to have to say so, Jeff, but I am rather tired of you injecting
politics into every discussion you can. It seems you never miss a chance
to inject whatever negative you can about your chosen demon.
If I wanted to be a member of a political forum, I would have joined
one.
I happen to have strong political opinions of my own, but I do
everything I can to make my posts on this list about Linux and it's
associated trials and tribulations.
If I wanted to, I could load this list with political diatribes about
various and sundry politicos and their cronies. I don't. Please do
likewise.
Dan
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 15:07 -0500, Jeff Lightner wrote:
> Well it was a specious argument anyway because it assumes that the phone
> company plays nice the way it is supposed to by law.
>
> By law the people that own the wire (ILEC = Incumbent Local Exchange
> Carrier) were supposed to open it up to resellers (CLEC = Competitive
> Local Exchange Carrier) in exchange for being allowed to sell long
> distance. What the ILECs did instead is pretend they were "open" but
> then do everything they could to sabotage the CLECs (e.g. not doing the
> central office connections in a timely fashion) so that CLECs couldn't
> really make a go of anything other than business connections.
>
> Unfortunately the FCC which was supposed to insure this didn't happen
> got taken over by Dubya appointees and suddenly it didn't matter that
> the ILECs weren't complying.
>
> You're supposed to have a choice but you don't really for the most part.
> Witness the poster who has DSL from AT&T but for some reason can't get
> it from any of the resellers because of the way it is provisioned.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ale-bounces at ale.org [mailto:ale-bounces at ale.org] On Behalf Of
> Jeremy T. Bouse
> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 2:14 PM
> To: ale at ale.org
> Subject: Re: [ale] [rant] I dislike "we only support winblows/OS X"AT&T
> internet
>
> Actually have you checked out http://www.att.net/legal/tos cause those
> specs you mention are no where within it nor is the explicit mention of
> Windows or Mac. Closest I can find is section 3. Equipment & Software
> and all it really says is:
>
> Due to the infinite number of possible combinations of hardware and
> software, you are responsible for the compatibility of your system
> with the Service. Any equipment that was not provided to you by AT&T
> is not the responsibility of AT&T , and AT&T will not provide
> support and will not be responsible for ongoing maintenance or
> management of such equipment. Any AT&T-provided modem will be either
> a new or a fully inspected, tested, and warranted return or
> repackaged unit.
>
> Which I can understand, I provide my own router/access point behind
> their DSL modem I'm not asking them to support that router but I am
> asking them to support their connectivity which they do provide and thus
>
> should support. Yes I've had their modems fail, I've also replaced my
> separately purchased Sangoma S518 ADSL card with their provided
> Speedstream to prove a problem was not my modem but the line as the same
>
> problem was occuring. If your call to tech support is network
> connectivity reasons, which I know for me is the only time I do ever
> call, then nothing in their TOS (so far as I can see) says support can
> be withheld because of your operating system.
> <http://www.att.net/legal/tos>
> Ned Williams wrote:
> > You miss my point.
> >
> > Regardless of what it takes to do a ping..you have their service you
> > agreed to their terms of service, that TOS states they only support
> > windows...that means you understood at the time of getting the service
>
> > that calling in because your Linux connected machine has a problem is
> > a lost cause. The effect of the operating system is not what is up
> > for debate, the effect of the contract the customer agrees too, is. Is
>
> > it a wrongly minded contract sure if your a Linux person, but that is
> > not of any consequence to AT&T. .If you don't like, don't be their
> > customer. That is your greatest method to effect chance upon them.
> >
> >
> > Ned
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 1:32 PM, Jeremy T. Bouse
> > <jeremy.bouse at undergrid.net <mailto:jeremy.bouse at undergrid.net>>
> wrote:
> >
> > But again these specs you quote also fall back to the issue of
> what
> > affect the Operating System has on OS-independent network routing
> > issues. Those are really specs for software being installed not
> > what is
> > needed to provide a level of network service connectivity. If they
> ask
> > you to do a ping does it really matter what OS you do it from?
> > Same for
> > traceroute, opening a web page, etc...
> >
> > Ned Williams wrote:
> > > If you have 19 machines on a network, why don't you have a
> > switch and
> > > a router and not force a linux box to do the job of the
> > aforementioned
> > > 10 dollar router?
> > > Sorry I know there are people out there who insist on
> demonstrating
> > > value in their stll creaking along 486/66 by making it their
> dsl
> > > router/firewall...but I mean rather than get spitting mad on the
> > phone
> > > with techs who you KNOW are not going to know squat about linux
> nor
> > > are they required too...(a google of "AT&T system requirements"
> > first
> > > hit spells out what they are required to support)
> > >
> > > * Intel or equivalent Pentium Pro, II, III, or IV at 133MHz
> > or faster
> > > * Windows 95/98/ME/XP or Windows NT 4.0/2000 (TCP/IP and
> > Ethernet
> > > support must be enabled)
> > > * RAM -
> > > o Windows 95/98/XP - 32 MB
> > > o Windows NT - 32 MB
> > > * Hard drive with 100 megabytes available
> > > * Ethernet Network Interface Card (NIC) or built-in Ethernet
> > port
> > > supporting 10 Base-T
> > > * CD ROM
> > > * Microsoft^(r) TCP/IP stack
> > >
> > >
> > > This means when you, you're gf, your mom,dad uncle or whomever
> has
> > > their service all agreed to these terms when you got the
> service..
> > >
> > > don't agree fine, get speak easy, they support Linux and your
> blood
> > > pressure will be lower...but don't expect the AT&T's Chennai
> > support
> > > center to understand the eccentricities of the latest Debian
> > release,
> > > when their product list is limited to windows only..
> > >
> > > and hey if it helps..they don't support Vista either
> > >
> > > Ned
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Jeremy T. Bouse
> > > <jeremy.bouse at undergrid.net <mailto:jeremy.bouse at undergrid.net>
> > <mailto:jeremy.bouse at undergrid.net
> > <mailto:jeremy.bouse at undergrid.net>>> wrote:
> > >
> > > The other problem with being able to go with any one
> > other than the
> > > telco is if you're like me, stuck behind a remote DSLAM the
> > telco
> > > won't
> > > provide the resellers with the ability to service you. Every
> DSL
> > > provider claims they can't service my house but I have the
> top
> > > speed DSL
> > > from AT&T. Luckily I don't have to call them for support too
> > often
> > > considering I've got a very non-standard configuration in
> the
> > > house that
> > > would drive their script-readers nuts, along with myself
> > trying to
> > > explain it to them.
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> > >
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> > >
> >
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